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I'm confused...

December 11th, 2011 (10:46 am)

current mood: confused

Okay... I know I'm just a simple Pagan and maybe this why I don't understand what's going on with the GOP and their supporters these days with their constant yammering about how this is a "Christian nation," their incessant prattling about what "good Christians" *they* are as opposed to everyone else, and their maniacal campaign to abolish all government programs designed to provide aid and comfort to the poor. Their own book, which they love to quote when it comes to denying equal rights and privileges to gays and non-Christians, says in Deuteronomy 15:7, 11

"If there is a poor man among your brothers in any of the towns of the land that the LORD your God is giving you, do not be  hardhearted or tightfisted toward your poor brother. There will always be poor people in the land. Therefore I command you to be openhanded toward your brothers and toward the poor and needy in your land."

And in Proverbs 28:27
He who gives to the poor will lack nothing, but he who closes his eyes to them receives many curses.

And finally in 1 Timothy 6:17-19

Command those who are rich in this present world not to be arrogant nor to put their hope in wealth, which is so uncertain, but to put their hope in God, who richly provides us with everything for our enjoyment. Command them to do good, to be rich in good deeds, and to be generous and willing to share. In this way they will lay up treasure for themselves as a firm foundation for the coming age, so that they may take hold of the life that is truly life

So here is where I'm confused: If all the above is the true "word of God" and these people are the TRUE followers of Christ, and this is indeed a "Christian nation" like they claim... shouldn't these people be pushing for MORE programs designed to help the poor and needy, not less?

They love to say that it's this country's growing tolerance for "perverts and heathens" (in other words gays and non-Christian faiths) that has caused God to turn his face from America. But they don't seem to see what, to me, are some pretty straight forward admonishments against turning your back on those in need and the consequences you can expect if you do: " I give you wealth so you can help the less fortunate among you. Refuse to do so and I will take that wealth away from you and give it to someone who will."

All that conservative Republicans and the Tea Party seem to be interested in is trying to find clever ways to convince themselves that while that may be what God and Jesus supposedly said, that NOT what they meant. But after watching the recent Republican presidential debates on top of all they've been screaming about since Obama took office in 2009, they have not so subtly accused Obama of being an evil secret Muslim bent on "destroying this country" and as proof they point to his "socialist agenda" of providing affordable health care to those who are sick, food and shelter to those who are hungry and cold, and trying to ensure our elders can live their twilight years in peace and comfort. My gods, what a BASTARD Obama is!!!!

I do not understand how any person of moral decency can continue to vote for these people...


Posted by: Nezdragon ([info]nezdragon)
Posted at: December 11th, 2011 06:51 pm (UTC)
Nezdragon sitting

I dunno, I know plenty of Christians who are quite kind and tolerant people. Personally, I think the government has too large of an overhead, and would rather give what I have in excess directly to those who need it (usually by way of a good charity that gives every dollar they take in). Not every screaming fundie represents the religion as a whole.

Posted by: EbonDragon News ([info]ebondragon)
Posted at: December 11th, 2011 08:11 pm (UTC)

I know there are a lot of good, decent Christians out there... just wondering why none of them seem to make it into the modern GOP, and all the politicians seems to be doing is catering the the most radical of their followers. I realize that the government can't take care of everyone, nor do I think that it should. There needs to be tougher regulations to stop those who try and game the system. However, I also don't think it is a smart thing to throw the baby out with the bathwater, so to speak.

Rather than getting rid of those programs and agencies designed to help the less fortunate change then so they actually *help.* Right now, the way government assistance is implemented it creates the very problem of perpetual dependence people bitch about because there is no graduated level of aid. It's an all or nothing hand OUT rather than an effective hand UP. People are not permitted to work at all if they want to receive assistance rather being encouraged TO work and then being given enough assistance be able to make ends meet, assistance that is scaled back as they become better equipped to take care of themselves and their families on their own.

For example, a friend of mine was looking for aid to get back on her feet after her divorce. She had a job, but it barely paid enough to meet all of her bills and allow her to adequately take care of her daughter. All she was looking for was a little help until she got back on her feet and could find a better paying job. She was told that if she wanted help, she would have to quit her job first. Where is the sense in that? They would have paid 3 times as much for her to go on full welfare than if they simply gave her enough to carry through. How does that possibly make sense?

But rather than working to change the rules the current leadership in the GOP wants to just scrap everything and let people fend for themselves. That they keep insisting that people are only poor because they choose to be shows how out of touch they are and how little "Christian charity" they actually have. Why is it that those politicians who claim to be the "true followers of Christ" seem to be the biggest hypocrites?

Edited at 2011-12-11 08:14 pm (UTC)

Posted by: Ethelshai ([info]ethelshai)
Posted at: December 11th, 2011 08:41 pm (UTC)

I think we're putting the here the finger on the difference between claiming to be religious and being really religious. Between saying one has personal convictions and actually having them.
Most self-righteous will always spit their alleged sacred beliefs to people in order to divert the public's attention from the fact those are nothing else but empty words used in empty hearts.

There are lots of people who have real beliefs and follow them, giving a lot of their own time and also a quite important share of their own ressources to help others. And these people generally don't use their faith as a way to show-off.

Posted by: dragngreylight ([info]dragngreylight)
Posted at: December 12th, 2011 02:05 am (UTC)

Not everyone who says they are a "Christian" necessarily is or acts like one. The GOP (also known as the 'Grand Old Party') is not a christian denomination or church of God. It is a political party that is part of the government (based on /404.html?r= ). That being the case it changes with the government according to current government policies. Basically the GOP is lying if they are telling people that they are the "good christians" compared to anyone else.

To their comment about God turning his back on the nation because it is tolerant of various religions, different faiths, etc. I don't see this. Especially since the Bible clearly states in more verses than I care to quote that we should "Seek and save the lost." where the lost are people of other faiths, religions, opinions, etc. So my question to them would be this: How can we reach out and save the lost if we do not allow the lost to be around us?

As far as this being a christian nation back when people like George Washington and Christopher Columbus were around this was a christian nation founded so that people who were christians would be free to believe and practice their own faith without fear of persecution.

The Boston Tea Party was a direct result of corruption by a government overseas who refused to allow the colonists, who ultimately founded the USA, the freedoms they wanted. So basically the original Tea Party was in protest to the overwhelming oppression the colonists were facing against a government that basically ignored and oppressed them.

They all should be trying to help those in need during these tough times instead of prolonging the current recession or making things more difficult. Though I don't believe the problem is entirely in the USA but may also be partly coming from overseas which our and other nations industries are directly connected too. The only way I see to fix the current crisis is for all the nations to meet and come to some sort of agreement on things like importing and exporting of merchandise, how to stabalize the economies, and what changes need to be made to ensure another crisis doesn't happen. One nation that went a long time throughout this global recession without being impacted by it is Canada. Which tells me they were doing something right. There may be others out there but that's the main one I've heard about.

Greylight S.

Posted by: Mottmon ([info]mottmon)
Posted at: December 13th, 2011 01:35 am (UTC)

With the way they act, you'd think that they were indeed their own church. The Church of Jingostic Nationalism, Xenophobia and Anti-intellecutalism, but still someone waving the banner of Jesus, you know.

Posted by: Mottmon ([info]mottmon)
Posted at: December 13th, 2011 01:41 am (UTC)

From what I've learned, one does not try to justify someone else's actions when they play the game by different rules than your own.

Seriously, their perspective of religion is entirely different than what reality is, unfortunately about 30% of our populace thinks along those exact same lines.

Worry not about what their holy book says because it's not relevant, instead focus on their actions, which by and large are fairly atrocious (Not saying that the entirety of congress doesn't deserve to be wiped off the face of the planet, DMCA and SOPA, I am looking at both of you). Unfortunately I have a feeling this has gone beyond "Voting the people out" too. I do feel that we require government and regulation to function as a society as a whole, but at the same time, a corrupt government is no better than anarchy. This coming from a proud and prideful socialist, no less.

All they really want is to funnel money and power into their own and corporate interests, the religious speak is mostly lip-service. Social non-issues to distract us from real problems in our world.

Posted by: david_ezra51 ([info]david_ezra51)
Posted at: January 10th, 2012 07:25 pm (UTC)

I too am confused with the politics of the day and I am a Southern Baptist Minister. The Christian faith is meant to be shared with our actions and words. It is not to be used as a political device to gain votes. BUT we need to have programs that teach people skills, help them find jobs and be productive citizens so they in turn can help others. In my understanding of the Scriptures, Christians are to be imitators of Jesus. We are to love one another as Jesus loved us, if Christians do that people will see the love of Christ.

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